Hand Viewer Redesign Feedback

[Muffy]

I like the new design of the hand viewer but i think it's not very practical.

I have problems to find a played hand, while i am on my session.
It would be better if there would be a button that only shows my played hands in the list.
I would like also to see the startinghands in the list, to find my hand better.

[ADK]

I posted a complaint about the new HM2 viewer on 2+2 and was told to post over in here. I use the hand viewer ALOT and I am getting quite tilted using the new design so I might aswell go pretty in-depth while you guys are listening. (FYI I never had a problem with the old HM2 viewer).


If you compare the two pictures above, can you honestly say that the HM2 viewer looks practical in any way?
Look how much easier it is to process the information on the PT4 viewer.

I really, really dislike the new HM2 viewer.
I have never seen the PT4 one before but it looks 100x better, really nice and easy on the eyes.


Here's my honest first thoughts:

HM2 New Viewer:
1. It's not simply or easy to look at.
- I am getting a headache just looking at a hand history in the viewer.
- Too many needless buttons ([C] [F] [R]), colours/backgrounds, and indentation makes it confusing.
- There is none of this pointless graphical stuff on the PT4 viewer and look how much easier it is to look at.
- There is way too much going on considering all we want to do is just read a simple hand history, quick and easily - I find the changes really distracting.


2. Most important information doesn't stand out.
- In the PT4 screenshot, the most important info is immediate identifiable (players, stacks sizes, action).
- I can just glance at the PT4 screenshot and find the most important information in under 1 second.
- I look at the HM2 screenshot and I am getting a headache for about 15 secs trying to figure it all out - I need to study it to find out what's going on.
- Player names don't stand out - I need to focus really hard to see who's in the pot.
- Where's the stack sizes? Takes me a while to find them - then I have to look back to the player names to see what stack belongs to who. It's not easy on the eyes.
- Who's in the pot and what action has been taken? The buttons make it really confusing. I am actually tilting a little bit right now looking at the HM2 viewer trying to figure it out. Look how easy it is to see on the PT4 screenshot or the old HM2 viewer.

If you posted the same hand history from a PT4 viewer screenshot vs the new HM2 viewer screenshot I am quite sure the majority of people would be able to read and process the PT4 hand history about 20 times quicker than the HM2 one and still have time to make a cup of tea.

I can just scan at the PT4 viewer and know what is going on straight away, who's in the pot and what action they took.
The bolded colours and minimal use of elements / seperate line breaks make it very clean/simple and easy to look at.
HM2 viewer I can't do this - I need to scan back and forth and see what is going on. There is about 3 times as many elements/lines to show the same information, nothing stands out and it's all over the place.

Basically it takes much longer to process a simple hand history in the new HM2 viewer, something a poker player doesn't need when playing or reviewing multiple hands.


I hope this didn't turn out as a rant as it's really not - Just genuinely want to help improve the viewer and those were my first thoughts.

Cliffs:
HM2 New Viewer: Need to study it for 10+ seconds to figure out what is going on.
PT4/HM1 Viewer: Can glance at it for 1 second and know exactly what is going on quick and easily.
A simple hand history made hard to read, simple as that.
Poker players want to be able to easily process information quickly and simply - especially while playing, or reviewing multiple hands. This can't be done with the new HM2 viewer format.

Get the design team to compare a HM2 viewer HH vs a PT4 viewer HH and I'd be amazed if anyone was able to process the HM2 HH anywhere near as quick.
This can be taken a step further by asking them to quickly find important information such as the stack size of someone and size of the pot on a certain street at the same time. PT4 viewer would win by a mile - and this ease and speed of processing is what it's all about for the user.

You had a winner with the HM1 viewer (but now seeing the PT4 viewer for the first time - It actually does look very nice and clean too, maybe even just a little better).

[fozzy71]

Thank you for the detailed feedback. I have forwarded it to the developers and management team to be sure they see it since oyu took so much time to give such detailed feedback.

[dissection]

something like this
smaller size, larger font and colors better

THIS ! IS BRILLIANT ! Simple, easy to read, compact. MUCH MORE BETTER THAN the old HEM2 HV and the new one HEM2 HV (biggest bullshit ever).

Why make a huge HV? Then easier to open replayer. HV must be compact, easy to view and fast mark a hand

THIS !

[dissection]

I personally like HM1 and PT4 HH viewer. It's very basic, i can understand what happen in the hand in a second. That's what I personally want from the HH viewer.

But i understand other ppl want notes, NC stuff, stats and all. By all means, add all that but put an option to remove it all, change colors, sizes, etc.

Totally agree with the first part.

For the second part: if thats true, why developers wouldn't make a choice for their users ? Turn on "expert hand viewer" or "basic hand viewer" ... would that be such problem ? I BET IT WOULDN'T !

[dissection]

something like this
smaller size, larger font and colors better

yes yes yes ! Please make it just like this guy did ! Its brilliant and simple !

[dissection]

I'm still very interested in this opportunity to come up with something much better for visualising the hands.

When/why do you switch to the replayer? What extra information is displayed? In my case I usually just click to a certain street and click through, but I'm not a power user and don't spend much time reviewing hands currently. To my mind the replayer is just a window on the actions and contains transient information. If we could include the best of the replayer info, together with the hand history information, and then add in calculated information regarding stack/bet/pot/odds ratios, for every single betting action in the hand, and have this information persistent, this would be a massive improvement in my mind.

Just getting some thoughts out there, I'll be back sometime to clutter the thread with more screenshots.

More input folks??

Hand viewer is just for quick and EASY look.

Replayer is the place where HUDs can be displayed and it's for post session review (more likely) with much more details and information.

Please, redesign the new HV (even the old one was bad). Make it nice and simple. If you got costumers who want crazy bad azz high tech hand viewer ... ok ... but make a possibility of choice for us to choose between one of those.

[dissection]

something like this
smaller size, larger font and colors better

ABOSLUTELY PERFECT ! Developers should take GOOOOD look at this !

[dissection]

There is an old principle, keep it simple; especially if something is going to viewed rapidly.

So, if I may:

* Old HM2 hand viewer and new HM2 hand viewer are not simple. I find them confusing because of the duplication of data and inclusion of data that (to me) is not essential. The viewer needs to be scanned quickly, that demands lean and mean.
* I also think the grey theme is not conducive to rapid scan. For me, data gets lost in the background.
* The mix of small and big cards, or just big cards, just adds to the confusion and makes my eyes bleed.

To meet my needs, HM1 & PT4 hand viewers work a treat.

Naturally, all the above is personal opinion only.

Exactly !

[dissection]

From 2+2

Originally Posted by fozzy71 View Post
Yes, there were many complaints about it after HM2 was launched. We know we can't make everyone happy but we tried to take the feedback we received in the various suggestion threads and incorporate it in to the new design. We need actionable suggestions about particular things you don't like about the new design and suggestions about how they can be changed/improved. Just saying 'its bad' doesn't help us. Our new hand viewer is very much a work in progress, and this is just the first release, but we need specifics if you want us to make changes that will improve it for you. If you don't want to post on our forums I would be glad to copy any constructive feedback and suggestions from here to there for you but if you are just going to curse about how bad you think it is with no suggestions as to what specifically is bad, and/or how it can be improved, then it is just a waste of both of our time.


Dissection (me)
Imagine something what is totally wrong. And you ask somebody: ok, tell me exactly what's wrong with it. Answer is: all. If you can't imagine such situation .. we are prolly living in other dimensions. New hand viewer is not lucid, confusing, hard to read, hard to orientate quickly. Take a look at other hand replayers (even online) or the one on PT4 and if even after that you won't understand ... you are lost. Hack my self can draw you better one ... jesus.