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View Full Version : AFq stats are wrong!!



tigerjack89
03-18-2013, 03:51 PM
Hey there.
Your AFq stats are completely wrong. I'm using HEM1, but I think the problem is the same for HEM2 because I know that the stats are implemented in the same way.
I filtered for today hands where I bet/fold the flop, here the result. Do you see my point?

106231

tigerjack89
03-18-2013, 08:05 PM
Point is:
"That's a lot of folding for 100% aggression!!!"
DUCY??

Patvs
03-18-2013, 08:53 PM
Read: http://forums.holdemmanager.com/manager-general/61131-aggression-frequency-aggression-percentage.html

I think there's a conflict with the filter you're using resulting in the wrong AFq. As a test, can you add AFq as a HUD stat to your HUD, and check if the AFq then looks normal.

tigerjack89
03-19-2013, 12:42 PM
I still have the AFq in the HUD; btw, from the formulas in your link, it seems that HEM doesn't take into account folds into the AFq stats, am I right?

So, AFq is not
(Bets + Raises) / (Bets + Raises + Calls + Checks + Folds) but just
(Bets + Raises) / (Bets + Raises + Calls + Checks)
right? Why a check is considered as a "passive" action while a fold as a "neutral" action?

filipjuan
03-19-2013, 01:18 PM
(Raise+Bet)/(Raise+Bet+Call+Fold+Check)*100
wtf? i have ever known that this is the correct formula????

tigerjack89
03-19-2013, 01:49 PM
(Raise+Bet)/(Raise+Bet+Call+Fold+Check)*100
wtf? i have ever known that this is the correct formula????
Me too, but it seems that we made bad assumptions. And it seems at least... LOL.

Patvs
03-19-2013, 09:21 PM
Yes, you're right. It seems
AFq is not
(Bets + Raises) / (Bets + Raises + Calls + Checks + Folds) but
(Bets + Raises) / (Bets + Raises + Calls + Checks)

tigerjack89
03-21-2013, 03:26 AM
Yes, you're right. It seems
AFq is not
(Bets + Raises) / (Bets + Raises + Calls + Checks + Folds) but
(Bets + Raises) / (Bets + Raises + Calls + Checks)
Do you think the formula will be changed or remain the same?

udbrky
03-21-2013, 04:16 AM
It should not change in the foreseeable future.

tigerjack89
03-21-2013, 04:29 AM
It should not change in the foreseeable future.
Why?? Don't you think is a wrong way to proceed?

Patvs
03-21-2013, 11:48 PM
I I think I see the confusion now.

Aggression Frequency isn't used in HoldemManager!
PokerTracker users are used to this stat.


We only use Aggression Factor and Aggression Percentage.

The 100% in your screenshot in the opening post is aggression percentage.
Aggression Percentage = aggressive action on each street. So if I bet the turn and the river but check the flop I would have 66% Agg Pct because I made 2 out of 3 aggressive actions. (folding has no effect on it)

tigerjack89
03-22-2013, 02:43 AM
I I think I see the confusion now.

Aggression Frequency isn't used in HoldemManager!
PokerTracker users are used to this stat.


We only use Aggression Factor and Aggression Percentage.

The 100% in your screenshot in the opening post is aggression percentage.
Aggression Percentage = aggressive action on each street. So if I bet the turn and the river but check the flop I would have 66% Agg Pct because I made 2 out of 3 aggressive actions. (folding has no effect on it)
It's not a PT - HEM differen, it's a conceptual difference.
I'll give you an example.

Player1: Bet 3 vtimes, raise 0 times, call 1 time, fold 8 times, check 2 times. Without looking to the stats, you would say that he is quite passive.
Agg% = (3+0) / (3+0+1+2) = 50%

Do you see my point?

Patvs
03-22-2013, 09:40 PM
b = bet
x = check
c = call

b/b/b - AF: inf, AFq: 100, Agg Pct: 100
b/x/b - AF: inf, AFq: 100, Agg Pct: 67
b/x/x - AF: inf, AFq: 100, Agg Pct: 33
b/x/c - AF: 0.5, AFq: 50, Agg Pct: 33
b/c/c - AF: 0.3, AFq: 33, Agg Pct: 33


HoldemManager uses AF (aggression factor) and Agg Pct.
Just add AF to your HUD?

Timothy88
08-21-2013, 09:03 AM
b = bet
x = check
c = call

b/b/b - AF: inf, AFq: 100, Agg Pct: 100
b/x/b - AF: inf, AFq: 100, Agg Pct: 67
b/x/x - AF: inf, AFq: 100, Agg Pct: 33
b/x/c - AF: 0.5, AFq: 50, Agg Pct: 33
b/c/c - AF: 0.3, AFq: 33, Agg Pct: 33


HoldemManager uses AF (aggression factor) and Agg Pct.
Just add AF to your HUD?

So is it true that HM2 doesn't use Aggression Frequency? Will you be adding this stat in the future perhaps, I prefer using it over AF.

udbrky
08-21-2013, 06:08 PM
Both are available in stats.

Patvs
08-21-2013, 06:39 PM
HoldemManager (both HM1 and HM2) don't use Aggression Frequency stats. We have no plans to add them.

Aggression Frequency is used by PokerTracker.

Instead we use Aggression Factor and Aggression Percentage.
Aggression Percentage and Aggression Frequency are somewhat similar to each other.

Aggression Frequency = (Bets + Raises) / (Bets + Raises + Calls + Folds) * 100%
Aggression Percentage = (Bets + Raises) / (Bets + Raises + Calls + Checks) * 100%