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View Full Version : Multi-table SNG EV Roi%



samone
10-20-2010, 05:12 PM
Hello. I'm trying to find out if this parameter (EV Roi%) is worth paing attention to when playing m-t sng's. Realized (when explored the Data View tab of Tourney->Results section) that each time we are ITM, our EV WON becomes equal to WON, though we played hands with before river allins and should have some difference between EV won and REAL won. Moreover I noticed that some of the tournaments are shown as 1 tabled, though the should be 2 tabled.

So. I got some questions:
1) If the $EV adjusted option shows enough close statistics to look at it?
2) Why when we are ITM $Won and $EV Won are equal?

Thanks beforehand.

morny
10-21-2010, 12:26 AM
1) The Ev is only calculated on 1 table sngs not MTT's, see this thread for more details FAQ - Hold'em Manager Poker Tracking Software :: EV Explained (http://faq.holdemmanager.com/questions/120/EV+Explained)
2) Its hard to answer this without seeing the hands, have you the latest version firstly and also are you playing 1 table sngs or MTTs?

thret
02-17-2011, 05:57 AM
So what does the Luck Adjusted Winnings line tell us in MTT SNGs? I've run an average of 10 buyins below that line every day this year... (around $23k, $500/day) is that an artefact of how it is calculated or am I just running very bad? For 18 and 45 man SNGs specifically.

Actually I can just upload the image. Is that normal, or do I just suck, or what? I'm not actually losing overall with rakeback and BOP etc but it isn't making me happy either.

Edit: I've just installed the latest version of HEM, it doesn't change the graph at all.

Patvs
02-18-2011, 01:09 AM
Luck Adjusted Winnings works for STTs only.
Can you filter that graph for (#players filter) 1-9 players only?

thret
02-18-2011, 02:12 AM
Yes, I realise it only works as advertised for STTs. I want to know what it is showing for MTTs. Why is it graphing it that way, what does it mean?

For STT the result is puzzling. I haven't played hardly any STTs so... not sure what it is doing here.

The Minder
02-18-2011, 03:44 AM
As Patvs says, there are some problems with the Luck Adjusted Winnings (let's call it 'LAW') graph in HM for anything other than STTs so you need to be careful interepretting data for multi-table SnGs. However, there is something just plain wrong with your graph.

The lines on a LAW graph can only do two things. The two lines can track each other or they can converge/diverge. They can even diverge for a while, come back together, cross over and then continue diverging the other way. The one thing these tracks CANNOT do is have one flatlining whilst the other diverges. The center 2/3s or your graph shows winnings essentially flatlining whilst the 'Luck' line diverges. I believe that that is mathametically impossible and means that there is probably some continuing errors within your database.

I compared this to my own db from last year (I also grind 18/27/45 SnGs) and verified that my two lines essentially tracked along together with the occasional blip when my AA got cracked at the wrong time, or my 78o killed my opponent. This is as it should be.

On a side note, your ITM is good but your ROI is not so good. You might care to investigate this further and do some research on bubble/FT play.

@Patvs. If the developers have time, and the interest, they might like to check this further by asking OP for some HH and TS data. There's definitely something wierd going on here.

Edit: At least in the second image you posted the lines are tracking correctly... the wrong way, but correctly.

thret
02-18-2011, 10:42 AM
I don't object to submitting my HH from this year if that would be of use. How could there be 'some continuing errors within my database', and is there a way to confirm or fix that if so?

Patvs
02-19-2011, 04:28 AM
Can you post a pic for one more graph:
filters for #players 10-300

Patvs
02-19-2011, 04:29 AM
For your MTTs, is Stars saving your tournament summaries?
Read tournament summary section @ http://faq.holdemmanager.com/questions/6/Poker+Stars+Setup


You need to request and import any/all your old tournament histories and import those to HM. Stars did not write the tourney summaries to your hard drive, like FTP does.

Pokerstars > Lobby > Requests > Tournament History .. > 200

Then you have to create a text file, from the email, to import to HM.

thret
02-20-2011, 02:33 AM
#players 10-300

Stars is saving tournament summaries, they were not auto-detected in HM. I've added the folder now and I'll see if it makes a difference.

Edit: No noticable change in any of the graphs.

netsrak
02-20-2011, 07:21 AM
Please zip and mail the original handhistory files and summaries (you find them in the HM archive folder or in the handhistory folder of your poker client) together with a link to this thread and an explanation of the problem to support@holdemmanager.net. We will then try to reproduce the problem.

Patvs
02-21-2011, 05:46 AM
The graphs look normal.

STT: you have a huge EV Diff (and you're playing them highly unprofitable)
MTTs: there is no EV Diff (and you're playing them highly profitable)


Combined in one graph (the first pic you posted) this then looks to be an impossible graph. But split into two (STT vs MTT), it's looks correct.
(unless you're saying the STT ROI of -75% is incorrect and actual WINS appear as losses in HoldemManager?)

thret
03-08-2011, 01:02 AM
So what happened with this? I sent the email with my HH, got no reply.

Patvs
03-08-2011, 01:36 AM
Combined in one graph (the first pic you posted) this then looks to be an impossible graph. But split into two (STT vs MTT), it's looks correct.
(unless you're saying the STT ROI of -75% is incorrect and actual WINS appear as losses in HoldemManager?)

thret
03-14-2011, 09:09 PM
Even if my STT ROI was -100%, it couldn't possibly look anything like that. STTs account for less than 5% of the total volume.

Also not sure how I could play or run so bad in STT? 9~18 are not so different.

Patvs
03-15-2011, 09:47 AM
STTs account for less than 5% of the total volume.



According to the graphs, you've played about 3200 games (SNG + MTT).
2100 MTTs
1100 STTs (that's 34% of the total volume)


Also not sure how I could play or run so bad in STT?

So either you really play AND run so bad in STTs (you run a lot below EV).
Or HoldemManager wrongly categorizes some of your MTTs as STTs.
Which would explain why you hardly have any 1th (and 2th/3th place) wins in your STT graph.

Check on Sharkscope.com what your graph looks like for ALL GAMES vs Sit & Gos (so use two searches). If the Sharkscope graphs look entirely different, than the HoldemManager graphs, email support@holdemmanager.com (or PM me) so we can setup a meeting where I can analyse your handhistories.

thret
04-04-2011, 09:54 AM
Unfortunately I've blocked my sharkscope account.

I played a total of 197 STTs so actually around 6.25%. I am getting this number from the Playing History Audit - 134 @ $60 and 63 @ $114, total loss $1807.50.

I would still like to know what it is doing for MTTs and why there isn't an option to just see cEV wrt bb's for all in situations in MTTs.

I'm interested in this meeting thing, I will PM you.