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View Full Version : Setting a morning start of day => counterintuitive single-day filtering



AKQJ10
04-07-2010, 02:44 AM
Observed: When I filtered tournament results by a single day for 2010-03-31, even though I had data for that date in my tournament results, I didn't see it. When I filtered for 2010-04-01, I saw data for the previous day!

Eventually I figured out that this only happened when I set my beginning of day to 6:00 am. When I removed the beginning of day, it worked as expected.

Explanation: I'm almost certain what's happening is that when I apply my date filter, say 2010-04-01, HM applies that as 2010-04-01 at midnight. So then it filters out the hands on the same "day" (HM day) as 2010-04-01 0:00 -- but if I didn't start any tourneys between Tuesday 0:00 and Tuesday 6:00, then filtering for say Tuesday is really only including tourneys for Monday.

Suggested behavior: When I set my start of day ("Set day starts at") to 6:00, it's because I occasionally start a tournament just after midnight before going to sleep for the day. I daresay quite a few poker players keep a schedule similar to mine, perhaps playing for as much as a few hours after midnight then sleeping from, say, 02:00 to 10:00 local time.

Just changing the definition of the specific day filter, say to 23:59 on the specified day, would fix the problem for us.

However it could introduce a new problem for someone who does the opposite, who sets their start of day to 18:00 because occasionally they start a tourney at 23:00 Monday that they really consider to belong to Tuesday. Again, I daresay there are relatively few people in this situation, waking up at say 21:00 local time and starting their poker day. (There might also be some users who track in Full Tilt time or some other site-specific time zone instead of local time.) These users need the present functionality preserved so that specific day filters pertain to 00:00 of the specified day.

If I had to default to only one as a quick fix, I'd change the single date filter to assume 23:59. But for a long-term fix I'd suggest having a configuration option somewhere to set this.

netsrak
04-07-2010, 04:08 AM
We introduced a new option->adjust site import times to bring the handhistory times from the files to your time zone.
If you use this adjustment you should be able to work without "Set day starts at"

AKQJ10
04-07-2010, 01:46 PM
I'm aware of that option, but not seeing the connection.

Let's say that I play two tourneys at 01:00 local time (Central Time) on Tuesday. One is on Stars and reports as 01:00. The other is on Full Tilt and reports as 02:00 Eastern.

If I set "adjust site import times" for FT to -1, now they both report as 01:00 on Tuesday. Both tourneys happened on my logical Monday. If I don't use ""Set day starts at" won't both of those tourneys be treated as Tuesday, not Monday?

morny
04-07-2010, 10:00 PM
lol i wont lie and say im not confused but i think the issue is caused because "my day starts at" only applies to the today and tomorrow filters and possibly one or two others. If the "my day starts at applied to the specific date filter it would line up, correct?

AKQJ10
04-09-2010, 07:02 PM
No worries about the confusion. I'm trying to explain it as clearly as I can but unfortunately, some wordiness is necessary. :)


If the "my day starts" at applied to the specific date filter it would line up, correct?

No, the phenomenon that I'm seeing suggests that it is applied to that filter.

Let's try a different way of explaining it. People who set the start-of-day to something besides midnight are doing it because they either want a little chunk at the beginning of the day attached to the previous day, or they want a little chunk of the following day attached to the following day. With me so far?

---

Later on I'll try to do some diagrams that are really legible, even though I'm not an artist. For now let's see if this is understandable:


Case A: I set SOD to 6:00 am because I want the first chunk of Tuesday to belong to Monday.

Monday 6 am ------------------Tuesday midnight^^^^^^Tuesday 6 am




Case B: I set SOD to 5:00 pm because I want the last chunk of Sunday to belong to Monday

Sunday 5 pm (17:00) ^^^^^^^Monday midnight ----------------- Monday 17:00




In case A I filter by the specific day Monday, but I don't get any tournaments in the diagrammed area. That's because HM considers the time frame shown in the diagram to be logical Tuesday, because it contains Tuesday midnight within it.

But I would say that 99.999% of the universe would consider that time frame to be logical Monday, because most people's "Monday" starts when they wake up in the morning and doesn't end until they go to sleep.

And the diagram has 18 hours of Monday and only 6 hours of Tuesday, so I think it's far preferable to call this logical Monday.

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In case B if I filter for only Monday, I'll get all those tourneys. In that case it's less clear to me, but it seems likely that someone with such a schedule would call that logical Monday also.

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In any event, in the real world use case A is a lot more common than use case B, I can almost guarantee you. But if there's a way to make this configurable without confusing the user base, I think that would be good.


Clearer or just more confusing now? :)

_Loki_
04-09-2010, 10:57 PM
AKQJ10...

How about a timebar displayed in the free space to the right in the HM menu bar ?
It would be like a display showing how a download was progressing & there would be a line that moved across the bar from left to right. If your day starts at 6am then at midnight the first 25% of the bar would be (for example) labelled 'mon' & the remaining 75% 'tue'

Or a line representing 'now' remains in the middle of the bar & the days seperater moves under it ?

################
kind of related - in an effort to understand this thread I conducted an experiment ...

There's a little problem when I group by Day ...

My 'set day starts at...' is usually this: 0 00

I found a session in CASH GAMES > Sessions & decided to see what happens if I changed 'set day starts at...' to a time in the middle of the session. The session I chose said Start Time of Session = 03/07/10 04:38:27 & End Time of Session = 03/07/10 07:09:49 (227 hands)

So I then did this:
Options > Miscellaneous options > Set day starts at 06:23

Now the above session is split into two groups like this:

A] Start Time of Session = 03/07/10 06:23:06 & End Time of Session = 03/07/10 07:09:49 (93 hands)
B] Start Time of Session = 03/07/10 04:38:27 & End Time of Session = 03/07/10 06:23:56 (134 hands)

BUT the last hand played in B] is the SAME hand as the first hand in A] ! This puzzles me because the total number of hands adds up correctly (227 = 93 + 134)

I closed HM & reopened to see if this is corrected, but no :)