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View Full Version : Why is "Raise first" stat higher than "VPIP" stat?



Alcibadies
03-28-2010, 04:04 PM
I'm trying to understand why my raise first stat is higher than my VPIP for a given position. I've read the definitions on the FAQ page and I'm still confused. How can the raise first stat be greater than VPIP?

morny
03-28-2010, 11:04 PM
please email the hands for the player that has a higher raise first than VPIP to support@holdemmanager.net and also link to this thread

dragonrib
05-29-2010, 10:19 PM
well, i have the same op doubt;

In my database, most of regulars has the raise first stat higher than vpip :/

von7thal
11-02-2011, 02:25 AM
just discovered the same problem in HEM 2. how can i fix it?

netsrak
11-02-2011, 05:09 AM
There is no fix - the stats are calculated independently on different sample sizes

von7thal
11-03-2011, 09:01 AM
Allright
Why are the stats calculated on different sample sizes? VPIP from the button and raise 1st from the button should include all hands which where played from the button? What is exactly the problem?
thx

Winged Guy
11-03-2011, 09:11 AM
C'mon guys. What the hell are you talking about? Raise first should almost always be higher than your VPIP.

RFI = flop unoped + you raised
VPIP = vpip in all situations.

When you're on the button AND unopened you Raise probably 50% of hands. So RFI-button = 50%. But when you are not unopened (somebody raised/limped) you enter the game much tighter.

RFI = Steal (we're just not familiar with calling A raise from EP as steal, but essentially it is)

von7thal
11-03-2011, 09:30 AM
as for as i know, VPIP (Voluntarily Put $ In Pot) includes all raises? when we voluntarily RFI it should count towards the VPIP as well.
If this is the case, RFI can't be smaller than VPIP

Patvs
11-05-2011, 02:27 AM
Example:
You're on the button 10 times.
You raise first on the button 3 times. (you fold once when you had the chance to raise first)
So the sample size is 4. You raise first button 3 out of 4 hands.

The other 6 hands, you don't have the chance to raise first (due to other players' actions before it's your turn to act)
You call one of their raises. You fold 5 times.
So your Button VPIP is 3 (raise first) + 1 (the raise you called) = 4 out of 10 hands

Your Button PFR = 3 out of 10 hands.


The number of hands these stats are based on (4 hands vs 10 hands) are different.