View Full Version : Difference btw. Flop C bet and Flop Raised Pot C bet

06-01-2009, 02:26 PM

I read the FAQ above giving detailed info on what all of the stats mean.

In the beginning there is an example comparing some of the differences:

One other thing youll come across in the explanations is this:
1) Continuation Bet
2) Continuation Bet Raised Pot
3) Continuation Bet 3bet Pot

To Explain the difference Between the three:

1) Included both pots where there was 1 or more raisers preflop
2) Includes pots where there was only 1 raiser preflop
3) Includes pots where there was 2 or more raisers preflop e.g 3bet

which makes it look like there is a difference.

But below in the chart the explanations don't sound all that different:

Flop Continuation Bet - Bet the flop after being the Pre Flop Raiser Preflop

Flop Raise Pot Continuation Bet - How often player Cbets after there was a raise preflop. (This stat is written wrong and it should read flop Continuation bet raised Pot.)

Is there a difference? Will I really have different numbers if I chose one over the other? What will the different numbers reflect? Please clarify, because if there is a difference the above info doesn't explain it very well.

Thank you.

Holdem Manager Training
06-01-2009, 04:22 PM
Flop Raise Pot Continuation Bet

Not reading what any guides say, but looking at my HUD stats, I believe this is how often someone raises a flop C-Bet. When I look at this stat for myself it's 22% and that sounds about right for me. So it means I raise people's C-Bets on the flop 22% of the time.

Does that answer your question?

Maybe someone else can chime in too. I'm 90-95% sure this is accurate.


06-01-2009, 04:44 PM
Thanks for your response, but isn't what you're referring to this:?

Raise Flop Continuation Bet - How often they raise someone when faced with a continuation bet on the flop

Click the FAQ in OP and look further down the chart, and you'll see above stat description.

Holdem Manager Training
06-01-2009, 05:19 PM
My appologies... I thought the "This stat is written wrong" was your wording. :-)

I'm unsure of your question now since there are so many different stats talked about there.

Also, I noticed this last stat talked about and the normal Flop-C-Bet stat has minimal difference in the range for everyone. 2% different at most on people where i have 25k hands on people.

If you're still not satisfied, reply again and I'm sure Morny or someone with more knowledge on this particular stat will jump in and help you out.

Personally, I just use Flop C-Bet and fold to Flop C-Bet when making decisions at the table on the flop. breaking it down further is information overload for myself since I play 6-8 tables.

06-01-2009, 09:03 PM
Right, that wording about "this stat is written wrong....", is in the FAQ description.

So, the question is:

Is there a difference btw.

Continuation Bet (wording in the example) which is the same as Flop Continuation Bet (wording in the chart) which is the same as Flop CB (wording in Player Preferences)


Continuation Bet Raised Pot (wording in the example) which is the same as Flop Raise Pot Continuation Bet (wording in the chart) which is the same as Flop Continuation Bet Raised Pot (also wording in the chart) which is the same as Flop Raised Pot CB (wording in Player Preferences).

I don't want to use both of those stats, I just want to be sure that the one I choose to use represents what I think it represents, and the description is not clear enough for me to have that confidence.

They actually seem by the descriptions to be the same thing, but if there is a 2% difference in that stat for players on whom you have a large db then they must not be the same, but then again 2% is probably not a big enough difference to care.

But now it's driving me crazy and I'd like to clarify it.

Thanks for taking the time to consider it.

Holdem Manager Training
06-01-2009, 09:24 PM
Sorry, wish I could give you an exact answer, but to be honest, I don't know.

Hopefully this screenshot clears things up about how close to the same these two stats are. Obveously there is a difference, but I don't know what it is.

Blue Numbers next to blanked out names are hands...
Red Arrow points to:
Left = Flop C-Bet
Right = Flop Raised Pot CB

As you can see there is very little difference between the two for everyone with over 10k hands so I'd stick with just using the Flop C-Bet stat.



06-02-2009, 01:19 PM
Ok i did try to read all this so hopefully im understanding the question properly which is whats the difference between

Flop Continuation Bet


Flop Raise Pot Continuation Bet

The only difference is the latter only includes raised pot (i.e There was a 1 PFR) wheras the first also includes 3bet pots where there was 1 raiser but also where there were 2+ raisers or 3bets/4bets

Obviously theres going to be very little difference but i find the raised pot one more reliable as the dynamics of 3bet pots can be different but obviously not that much different judging by the screenshots so maybe it dosent really matter

06-02-2009, 02:08 PM
Morny you do understand the question.

I came to the same conclusion based on the first part of my original post.

But if you click on the link for the FAQ's, and look at the descriptions below in the chart, it doesn't seem so clear.

06-02-2009, 04:07 PM
Yeah weve someone that working on updating all those FAQs as theres a lot of new stats since so well try and make it as clear as possible

06-02-2009, 05:33 PM
Yeah weve someone that working on updating all those FAQs as theres a lot of new stats since so well try and make it as clear as possible

Not to mention that the built in HUD popups use slightly different variable names than are available to the user in the HUD popup configuration for the same underlying statistic.

Appears to needlessly add to the complexity of using the existing popups as templates in HUD popup designer. However, if the practice is to be continued it would be nice to have each and every name properly noted in the FAQ.